Kevin Gaskell : People Behind The Pedals

Transcript

Simon

Hi, and welcome to the People Behind The Pedals podcast, and today we’re going to be talking to Kevin Gaskell.

Now, Kevin normally gets invited to talk about business and his sporting achievements, but we’re actually going to talk to him about his hobby, which is playing in a rock band.

But before we do that, a few words of introduction.

Kevin has been CEO of Porche, Lamborghini and BMW, where he led hugely successful turnarounds and business growth.

He’s climbed mountains, walked to both the North and the South Poles, and set the world record for rowing across the Atlantic.

And if you’d like to know a little bit more about that side of things, you can catch his book called Catching Giants, which is a really good read.

So welcome, Kevin.

Thanks very much for chatting to us. So let’s get straight into it.

What got you into music in the first place?

Kevin

Well, I’ve always loved music, as a listener, as an avid listener, I’ve always enjoyed music of all types, really.

And at school, I wanted to learn to play an instrument, and I ended up with a trombone, and I ended up with a trombone because I wanted the cornet, and there were no cornets left, so they said, well, here, have a trombone.

So I did, I don’t know, a year or so learning to play the trombone.

I didn’t enjoy it. It really wasn’t me.

And then at the age of about 14 or 15, I decided I would like to play guitar.

I’d started playing guitar at school as well.

They had some acoustics and I learned to strum along, but I wanted an electric guitar.

And so about 14 or 15, I went out and bought for 12 pounds, a Zenta Stratocaster copy.

I don’t know if Zenta even exists any longer.

Simon

I do remember them. I’m not sure if they exist.

Kevin

Yeah, so that was my first guitar, and it went from there, really.

Simon

Fantastic. So were you in a band early on?

Kevin

Yes, we had a band at school, and then that kind of rolled into the sixth form, and we played at the school dance.

And like any budding teenage band, we had a lot of fun playing and cobbling together old bits of kit and hiring bits of kit.

And I’ve still got the amplifier here with me now that I used to hire when I was in the sixth form that I eventually bought, it was a piece of junk in the corner, but it’s a 1963 Fender Bassman, original.

And I paid 80 quid for it, and my dad went nuts.

Well, I don’t know what it’s worth today, but a lot more than 80 pounds, I would think.

Simon

Maybe one of the best investments you’ve ever made at 80 quid.

Kevin

Yeah, I think so.

And I’m just having it fettled at the moment because I mean, I’ve had it for 50 years, and I don’t use it for gigging.

I used it for gigging in the band I play in now.

But it got to the point where there were too many people casting eyes over it, and I thought, no, this is a bit dangerous.

So I retired it.

Simon

So what do you use now?

Kevin

I use a Crate V50, which is nice.

And you know, it’s got so much oomph in it, but the trouble is it weighs 65 pounds.

And I’m just at the point of thinking, it’s time to change to one of these Fender Tone Master amps, which give you all the performance, but at less than half the weight.

So I’m casting eyes over those as they pop up on eBay occasionally at the moment.

Simon

So when you were first sort of in your band, I mean, I know we touched in the introduction on your sort of really impressive business CV.

Was music ever a career consideration?

Kevin

No, I’m no way near good enough.

And I’ve never had a lesson in my life.

I’m just not good enough. So I never took it seriously.

My focus was very much on business and sport as I played a lot of sport.

And the music just, it got more serious when I moved through my career and joined bands in the companies where I was working.

And typically joined a band which was people who had been musicians.

Some of the guys I play with today have been session musicians.

You know, they’re very talented.

And I’m very happy to be the second or third guitar and the doo-wop singer at the back.

I just enjoy it.

Simon

So what’s your current set up? What does the band look like?

Kevin

Well, the band is either a five or a six piece, depending on who’s available.

So it’s two guitars, bass, drums, saxophone.

Saxophone is played by a lady, who also sings.

And then we occasionally, we dip in and out of having a keyboard player.

Keyboard players seem to go on and do other things, and we lose them.

So the band I play in now, we’ve been together for 28 years, 27 years.

Not quite, not quite the same line up, you know, a bit like Trigger’s Brush!

But there are three of us who’ve been there for that length of time.

And the other two were in the band for three or five years before that.

So we’ve been playing a long time.

Simon

And are you doing covers or are you writing your own stuff or a mix?

Kevin

No, no, no, it’s all covers.

We’re a party band.

We like to get people up and dancing, and we like to play the stuff that we like to play.

And that’s anything from the 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s, 00s, 10s, 20s.

And we play all kinds of stuff.

But we have, yeah, I mean, the guys say the guys are very good musicians.

And then we had for a while a guy called Chris White, who is the sax player from Dire Straits.

And Chris is a very good friend of mine, has been for 30 years.

And when the Straits weren’t touring and he got a bit bored, he used to come out and tour with us.

Well, not that we really toured, but Chris would come out and play with us, which was always great fun.

And, you know, we’ve had a couple of comments like, now that lad on the sax, he’s really good.

He can make a living doing this.

So we said, well, you should go and tell him.

Simon

What was that sort of typical sort of pub gigs and that type of thing?

Kevin

We don’t play pubs, actually.

We’ve never played pubs.

No, because the two guys who have been in the band the longest, and they are the two who have been session musicians, they said, no, we don’t want to play pubs.

And so we’ve always managed to get bookings at private parties and corporate events and black tie events.

We once played at the Hilton on Park Lane, which was an experience because it was an automotive industry, and I’ve been working in the automotive industry.

It was auto industry, a black tie bash, and nobody had announced to the band work.

And all the people in the band at that time worked, as I did, at BMW GB.

And I was the chief exec.

We had the legal director, customer service director, marketing director, training manager, and Jill was a motorcycle marketing manager.

I could still see the faces on some of the people in the crowd when they drew the curtain back, and people who were my dealers, and my 1500 people in this place.

I could still see their jaws dropping.

And then the kind of look of terror in their eyes was they thought we were going to make a mess of this, and we

Simon

So it’s really interesting, actually, the combination of your business experience.

Do you find yourself being the leader and organizer of the band, or is it a pleasant break to be away from that sort of thing?

Kevin

Well, it’s a pleasant break to be away from it, and as a band, we are all, you know, we’ve all led divisions of businesses, and so very strong people around me.

So no, I’m not the leader of the band.

The lead guitarist is really the leader of the band, but everybody mucks in.

It’s a very collegiate atmosphere.

We work well together.

We like each other.

We have fun together.

And so it all works very well.

And for once, I’m not expected to take the lead as I am in business, which is, of course, nice.

Our lead guitarist is the chief executive of the Institute of the Motor Industry.

You know, this is a guy who’s dealing with the government day in, day out.

So these are pretty high profile people, and playing in a band is just a pleasant release.

But you know, it’s fun because we turn up, particularly when we were all at BMW, and we all had very fancy company cars, you know, 7 Series and X5s and this and that and the other.

And we would turn up to this gig where we’re being paid 500 quid to play.

And you’d have people looking at you saying, you boys must do a lot of gigs in the year to run these cars.

We say, oh yeah, yeah, we work hard.

Simon

So what’s been the biggest challenge sort of keeping the group together?

You know, it’s been quite very impressive that you’ve been doing it for a couple of decades with the same core members.

Kevin

Yeah.

I mean, the biggest challenge is that people have moved on.

We were all at BMW GB, and so we were all in the same office, and we used to use the training room for rehearsal.

And therefore, it was very easy.

You know, every week or two, we’d be playing a gig, and every week or two, we’d have a night of rehearsal and you put some new material into the set.

But as time has moved on, people have moved.

So lead guitarist lives in Norfolk.

Bass guitarist lives in Hereford.

Jill, the sax player, lives down on the South Coast.

I live in Berkshire.

Who have I missed?

Dave on the drums.

He lives in Oxford.

So we’re covered over quite a wide area now, and it’s a big commitment.

Yeah.

People have got to really want to do it, to drive for three hours.

Yes, indeed.

For rehearsal.

Simon

Have you ever tried using the sort of virtual rehearsal room type of…

Kevin

No, we haven’t.

No, we haven’t.

Because for all of us, it’s as much as social.

We’ll do a couple of hours of practice, and then we’ll pop a bottle of wine, and drink wine and chat for an hour, and then we’ll get back and do another hour of practice.

So for me, it’s one of my most enjoyable and one of my most important social events is to be with these ladies and gentlemen.

Simon

I can really understand that.

You touched earlier on your Fender Bassman, and I suppose because of who we are, we really ought to chat to you about gear a little bit.

So are you a collector of guitars and bits and bobs, or do you just have sort of one trusty go-to?

Kevin

Well, I say I’m not a collector, but I’m looking now, past this microphone, at five guitars hanging on the wall, and two on stands on the floor.

And I have another one that I keep somewhere else.

So what’s that?

One, two, three, four, five, six, seven, so I have eight guitars, which is plenty, but is nothing compared to our guitarists.

We lose count of how many Steve’s got.

But it must be well into the 20s.

And he turns up with a different guitar each time.

I tend to play the same guitar.

I’ve worked my way through and started with a Strat.

It was the first proper guitar that I bought.

And I bought a new American Stratocaster.

And then I bought a Les Paul, which I really liked, but haven’t played it.

I probably haven’t taken it off the wall in five years.

Yeah.

And then my family bought for me a Telecaster for a birthday, a big birthday.

And that’s the one I use.

And not because of the emotional connection, the sentimental connection, but because I just like it.

I enjoy playing it.

It’s a nice thing to play.

It’s light.

I can get all kinds of sounds out of it.

And so I like it.

There’s a sort of wonderful simplicity about them.

I don’t know if it’s just because there’s sort of heritage implicit in them.

But yeah, I’m a fan, I must admit.

Yeah, you can’t really go wrong with it.

I mean, it takes everything you throw at it.

And I can get everything from really chunky sound out of it right up to very tinkly sound and everything in between.

So I really do enjoy it.

And I take other guitars to gigs with me, and I start with a Telecaster and I never put it down.

So it does everything I need.

Simon

That’s fantastic.

Are you a pedalboard man, or is it sort of straight into the amp?

Kevin

No, I have actually got a pedalboard here.

It’s down in the barn where we rehearse at the moment.

So I’ve got a pedalboard with five or six pedals on it.

And they are the standard mix.

I’ve got an overdrive pedal, I’ve got a tremolo pedal, I’ve got a reverb pedal, a chorus pedal.

And I bought a phaser just a couple of weeks ago, actually, because we were playing one track.

And we didn’t have a keyboard, and I opened the track, and I wanted to sound as much like the original as possible.

And I bought a phaser, and it sounds pretty good, actually.

It’s pretty good.

Simon

Fantastic.

Do you stick with all one brand, or do you mix and match?

Kevin

I have stuck with one brand.

These are all Boss pedals.

And there’s not really a reason for that, other than I bought a couple of Boss pedals.

And then I bought the case, the board to sit them in, and well, the Boss pedals fit in the Boss box, so that’s one.

There’s a lot to be said for that, and they’re industry standard, really, aren’t they?

Yeah, and you know what?

They’ve never let me down.

They work a treat.

They sound good.

I have them set to the sounds that I want, and now that my kids have grown up, they’ve stopped fiddling with the knobs, so it’s never a surprise when I press the pedal.

They used to come in and turn knobs willy-nilly.

But yeah, they work for me, and I like them and I trust them, and I feel comfortable on stage.

I don’t have any worry.

The only thing I’ve changed recently is I’ve gone wireless from the guitar to the pedal board.

And I expected to have some fuss without some difficulty, but I actually don’t.

It works a treat.

So that’s been really good.

It gives me a lot of freedom on stage.

You can literally walk around, and if you want to do a sound balance, I can walk off stage, and it all still works, which is great.

It’s really very convenient.

I like it a lot.

Simon

So, Kevin, in terms of other hobbies, what keeps you busy?

Kevin

Well, what keeps me busy is firstly work, because I still chair four companies and actively involved in three others.

So I work a lot.

I speak at conferences all over the world, which is a bit like music, really, because you are performing up in front of a couple of thousand people, and you are entertaining and informing, hopefully.

And but for hobbies, my hobbies these days are expeditions, which I have been doing for a long time.

I grew up in North Wales.

I was climbing mountains at the age of 12, 13, 14.

And it went from small mountains to big mountains.

So I have gone out and now with my son climbed some of the world’s biggest mountains, which has been great fun.

And then I got to the point where I thought, well, I have climbed a lot of mountains, so what else can I do?

We decided it would be a good idea to walk to the North Pole.

So we walked to the North Pole.

And then we thought, well, if you have done the North Pole, you might as well walk to the South Pole.

So we walked to the South Pole.

And then again, we ran out of ideas.

So what should we do next?

And we do these things every couple of years.

And I said to my son, how do you fancy rowing across the Atlantic?

And he said, no.

I said, why not?

Come on, Matt.

Because we’ve done expeditions together since he was 12.

And he said, no.

And I said, what do you mean, no?

He said, listen, it’s pain, pain and more pain, and then you die.

So I thought, okay, I’ve got to get a crew together because I can’t do it on my own.

I don’t know anything about rowing.

I’ve never rowed in my life.

And there’s a race that goes from Spain to Antigua.

I thought that’s the way to do it because they’re organized and at least it won’t just be me out in the ocean.

And that’s what we did.

We entered this race, and we got hold of a 27-foot rowing boat.

And we set off from La Gomera, Spain, and we rowed to Antigua.

And we set our sights on breaking the world record.

And everyone told us we were nuts.

You can’t do that.

You’ve never rowed before.

How are you possibly going to do that?

There’s Olympians have rowed this route.

They’ve set the record.

And we talked amongst ourselves.

And I took the same approach I take in business really, which is you kind of can’t outspend, but you can outthink.

We couldn’t out row, but we could out plan, we could out organize.

And so we prepared for two years as a crew of five.

And we set off and we broke the world record.

And I’ve written that story in my latest book, which is called Catching Giants.

And it’s the story and part of the adventure, explaining to people what it’s like to be in the pitch black in a force five in the middle of the Atlantic when a wave hits you and snaps two of your oars.

But at the end of each chapter, I put lessons for life and for business, for anybody really.

How do you go out and do things that you didn’t think you could do?

So that’s what I do for fun.

That’s what keeps me entertained.

Simon

And that’s Catching Giants.

Right, I’m going to head off to Kindle after we finish speaking and have a good look.

Kevin

Yeah, you can get it on Amazon.

I was up for Best Business Book of the Year in 2023, so it’s been very well received.

We’re on the third reprint now.

Simon

That’s really good.

That’s amazing.

Kevin

Yeah, fantastic.

Simon

Well, Kevin, thanks so much for speaking to us.

It’s really interesting actually to chat to somebody who’s been obviously enormously successful in one particular area and still has music as their hobby and gets a great amount from it.

So I think everybody will be really interested to listen to this, and it’s a slightly different take on the musical world.

So thanks so much for doing it.

Kevin

Oh, you’re welcome.

The only thing I didn’t tell you was the name of the band.

The band is called The Hodds, H-O-D-S.

The Hodds.

Yeah, it stands for Heads of Departments, because that’s what we all started.

Simon

Not a bunch of bricklayers then.

Kevin

The Hodds, yeah.

Simon

Well, it’s been great talking to you.

Thanks a lot, Kevin.